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Why Skiers Sometimes have a hard time learning to skiboard properly

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  • Why Skiers Sometimes have a hard time learning to skiboard properly

    As a long time skier , I have come to understand that we skiers have a hard time learning how to skiboard properly and that those of you who come to skiboarding from skating or snowboarding backgrounds have it easier.

    Properly skiboarding sometimes involves unlearning a number of counterproductive skills that we use when skiing and learning new skils .

    As skiers we tend to be set back on narrow long skis , we tend to have our skis flatter and turn by using poles unweighting our skis and then sharply edging our skis to slow down which often involves a bit of a slide as well , all of this more from the rear of the ski ..

    Here is a pic of this technique ...


    Skiboarding is all about having both of our edges right up on edge with extreme (for skiers ) edge angles.. because of the nature of skiboards it is much easier to get these edge angles at slower speeds then long skis . Ski racers on long skis get the same kind of edge angles but need to be going alot faster and most of us skiers on our long skis do not acheive the edge angles that most skiboarders obtain routinely on their boards.
    BUT it does take skiers a bit of time to get it right on skiboards and if we skiers try to SKI our skiboards with flatter boards and do not get our boards over we cannot acheive proper edge control on firm snow with our boards . I have found that by by riding center mount and throwing away my poles and getting the feel of this type of turn on shorter skiboards like my KTP 101 has helped me immensely in skiboarding my longboards properly.
    You can ski longboard skiboards from the back seat with poles with flatter edge angles and get them down the slope but you absolutely will lose out on the performance that is inherent in these skiboards .

    I learned this this weekend myself as I was riding my Sherpa like Skafreak rides his . There are different styles in riding our skiboards , you can be lower to the board or higher on the boards . the boards can be closer together or further apart but the edge angles are the same . Proper performance skiboarding involves riding centered on a widebodied fat twin tip short board and immediately tipping both edges right up on edge and moving smoothly from edge to edge without lingering in the flat phase that most of us skiers tend to do . It is important to get this right and feel the edges engage and smoothly go from carve to carve . I am a slow learner myself , because , as an "expert "skier . I THOUGHT I Knew how skiboards should work . I actually didn't know at all how to do it correctly and it is only now after a few seasons of beating around the bush that I have finally GOTTEN it .. it is like a light bulb going off in my head and it is the most important skill for skiers to learn to really GET into true performance skiboarding and NOT just skiing skiboards like skis .

    Here is a couple of pics of guys who have it exactly right , two very diferent styles , both guys on the same Sherpa 130's centered and poleless relaxed ,skiboarding ,with both edges right up on carve .

    First Skafreak in the world famous SBOL , revel 8 style



    Next a pic of rider Dan Curren in a more upright , boards together style ( thanks Jeff for sharing that pic , it is great !!)


    Look at the edge angles of the boards , these are edge angles that skiers usually only obtain at high speeds, all of us skiboarders are getting these edge angles routinely on our skiboards . It is right there waiting for us to use , BUT we need to start out centered and poleless to really GET it right .. later we might want to move our bindings back a bit in deep pow so we don't have to work so hard ... but it IS ESSENTIAL to first start out centered and poleless to really understand how skiboards should be ridden and how they work best . I , like a lot of skiers , have been pretty lame about this and not understanding that skiboards really are a different tool then skis . They look like skis but riding them DOES require learning some different skills , once you do a huge performance envelope opens up and skiboards that you might have thought were only short "easier "skis become the stuff of dreams , truly complex , high performance all mountain tools with heavy MAGIC , you will NEVER , EVER want to step on a pair of skis again !
    Last edited by jjue; 03-17-2008, 08:38 PM.
    Boards :
    Spliffs
    DLPs
    Condors
    Slingshots
    Sherpa

    Boot:
    K2 BFC 100

    Bindings:
    Zero Pro Non release Binding
    Modified Receptor Backcountry Bindings (Bill Version and Slow Version)
    Spruce ProPrime Plus Binding/Riser with Attack 13 GW binding
    Custom Risers with Fritschi Backcountry Bindings (Jeff Singer version 1, Bill version)

  • #2
    Jack, you are absolutely right. I actually had just logged onto SBOL because Jeff shared your email to him with me and it really got me thinking about how this had never been discussed. I have a background in both skiing and snowboarding before I ever strapped on a pair of snowblades and got a taste of skiboarding. The most important thing to emphasize to people who are riding them for the first time is to ride them in smooth connected carves like a good snowboarder would. Skiboards get really squirrely when you let them sit flat on the snow, so you can't just let them track like you would skis. You also really lose the feel of the skiboards if you set them back. In my first review of the 130's, I tried the setback with the powder plate, and in the end just ditched the powder plate for a completely center mounted board, and that's when it's performance really jumped out at me. That is why I have come to love skiboards over the other two. Once you get this fluid edge to edge carving, you just feel like you have way more degrees of freedom than on skis and snowboards. You don't have both feet strapped to one plank or two huge long planks that you have to fight to snap a quick turn. It's the reason I'm more than content to cruise down nice steep blue groomers for a whole day, but then will turn around and kill moguls and steeps the next, and then next time spend a day in the park. The sherpas went even farther to open open deep powder to me better than any boards I had so far. There has not been a condition that I have put them through that they have felt out of their element. Sure they aren't as quick and snappy as sub 100 boards, but they still are skiboards and as long as you let them, will ride like skiboards.
    I do it because I can.
    I can because I want to.
    I want to because you said I couldn't.

    "The butterflies in my stomach have flown up through my throat and learned to love the open air." - World/Inferno

    Spruce Sherpas with Prime Pros
    '08 KTPs

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    • #3
      Tha Dan Curren pic.........................how many lift tickets do you NEED in the US! :-) :-)
      Crossbow (go to dream board)
      Most everything else over time.
      Go Android

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      • #4
        my uncle really couldnt get the hang of skiboarding, he really didnt like the whole edging thing.
        all the gear and relatively little idea.

        riding condors

        www.exclaimskiboards.co.uk

        rectangle

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        • #5
          nice post guys, interesting.


          ONE TIME I HUNG OUT WITH DAVE LYNAM IN PERSON

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          • #6
            Very good posts, and very accurate. I've found this same thing myself when introducing others to skiboards. It can take some work to get people to break their habits from skis.

            Something else that I've found though is that people who have never skied can also try to ski skiboards. I'm thinking it might have to do with watching skiers and not seeing skiboards before. With this in mind, I try to demonstrate good skiboarding technique before I send people down the hill.
            RVL8 Condors - The Flex will be with me, always...until I break them

            Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming... "WOW! WHAT A RIDE!!"

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            • #7
              Thanks for sharing.
              I started out this year wanting to be a better skier. I even had taken an indoor skiing course (on a treadmill) over the summer. But I went out twice on skis and still didn't feel that I was getting the edges right. I saw two guys on rental skiblades, rented them the following week. Then bought some Revel8s.

              Now all the stuff I learned from the indoor course, I can translate to skiboards. Being conscious of stance, pressuring and edging. It's like everything made sense. Next year I might trying skiing again!!

              One thing that is great about skiboards. You learn to get parallel,fast. You skip the wedging phase. Wedging just doesn't cut it on short "skis". You aren't going to stop quickly. You have to learn to hockey stop.

              Also no poles. You learn to skate the flats and herringbone slight elevations. Also no poles to lose when you fall or hold onto on the lifts!!!
              ALP with Spruce Riser and Rossi 100
              Wife on Chickens

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              • #8
                tbh, i dont even see why they both teaching the snowplough first on skis. surely it would make much more sense to teach everyone to hockey stop and parrell turn firs.t

                although admitadly, when turning down steeps, because im not very confident on them, my feet naturally snowplough.
                all the gear and relatively little idea.

                riding condors

                www.exclaimskiboards.co.uk

                rectangle

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by taimos
                  tbh, i dont even see why they both teaching the snowplough first on skis. surely it would make much more sense to teach everyone to hockey stop and parrell turn firs.t

                  although admitadly, when turning down steeps, because im not very confident on them, my feet naturally snowplough.
                  I don't know how you can snow plow effectively on ski boards. My Marauders have to be pushed out so far to snow plow that it actually hurts the hips so I avoid it like the plague. Trying to get both boards up on the inside edges is just too difficult with too low a yield (in stopping power) to be of value.
                  H2O Junkie
                  "If your cheeks aren't flapping in the wind, you aren't going fast enough!"

                  Dynastar Twins, Summit Marauders, HO 720, O Brien Pro Trac, KD Evolution Carbon, Hyperlite Scape 116, O'Brien Swindle 139, Liquid Force Venture

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by H2O Junkie
                    I don't know how you can snow plow effectively on ski boards. My Marauders have to be pushed out so far to snow plow that it actually hurts the hips so I avoid it like the plague. Trying to get both boards up on the inside edges is just too difficult with too low a yield (in stopping power) to be of value.
                    H2O,

                    I think the 1 degree base bevel is causing this to happen. My Summit 110 can snow plow much easier now with the bevel removed.

                    Wendell
                    Now: 08 Sherpa's (2), Atomic 120's, 2013 125 Protos, 125 LEs, 2014 Sherpas, Osprey protos, 2015 Blunt XL's, 2016 Ospreys, Ethan Too twintip skis,2017 Shredfest One of kind Spliffs, 2018 Crossbows
                    Bindings: Spruce Risers and Tyrolia LD12's
                    Boots: Full Tilt Booters, Tecnica Agent 110
                    History: Atomic shorty's, Sporten, Groove Taxis, Head 94's, ALPs, Spruce 120 Blue boards, Custom Lacroixs, Rocker Condors, 08 Summit 110's, Hagan offlimits 133's, Rossi 130's, 2011 Summit Marauders

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                    • #11
                      you should be doing the same on skiis
                      "1 out of every 10 adults suffers from alcoholism and 2 out of 5 teens 12-18 suffer the same".

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