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The Andorra 2020/21 Skiboarding Report

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  • #16
    Originally posted by ysb33r View Post
    So far my only criticism of the Ospreys is their performance on icy ridge traverses.
    You mean going up or going down ? If it's downhill, it makes me think of the Spruce 125 , they are reputed for a good edge hold on ice. Being narrower than the Ospreys they might be less slippery on the uphill as well. But probably not the same floatation in deep powder, although they are quite good, but I cannot tell compared to the Ospreys. Might be a middle ground between skis and Ospreys, don't know if you tried them already
    Myself: RVL8 2015 Blunt XL, RVL8 2009 ALPdors, Spruce 125 LE, Spruce 2016 Osprey
    Daughter: Twoowt Pirania 95cm; RVL8 2010 Revolt Trees; Spruce 120 Yellow/Red

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by newbie2011 View Post
      You mean going up or going down ? If it's downhill, it makes me think of the Spruce 125 , they are reputed for a good edge hold on ice. Being narrower than the Ospreys they might be less slippery on the uphill as well. But probably not the same floatation in deep powder, although they are quite good, but I cannot tell compared to the Ospreys. Might be a middle ground between skis and Ospreys, don't know if you tried them already
      Going up.

      Down is not a problem as the boards are together and continually moving and one tends be on a carve which creates more edge engagement.

      The problem on ascent is that one board has to hold firm whilst the other is moved forward. Gravity is not a friend in this case. Keep in mind that the heel is loose, so as one leg moves forward, the other leg's heel would want to start lifting. This moves the holding force to the toe rather than being spread across the edge on the length of the foot.

      Sent from my Mi Note 10 Pro using Tapatalk

      Current: '20 Spruce Slingshot 119s, '20 Spruce Crossbow 115s, '18 Spruce Osprey 132s (touring), '21 Rvl8 SII 104s, '21 Summit Invertigos 118s
      Also: '11 Allz Elaila 94s, '12 Rvl8 Rockered Condor 110s, '15 Spruce Osprey 132s , '18 Spruce Crossbow 115s
      Previous: Gaspo Hot Wax 84s, Mantrax 98s, Summit Nomad 99s, Spruce Yellow 120s, Eman Uprise 104s

      Comment


      • #18
        Yesterday I went out on touring skis again. My skiing technique on them is improving. Can now do proper parallel turns.

        Carved turns on these planks seem impossible, best is some skiddish parallel turns. slarved turns seemingly are out of the question - primary due to flat non-rockered tail I think.

        I did the same route today with Ospreys. The jury is still out of which is better for ascent, but skiing back there is one clear winner - Ospreys. The no-brainer turns,
        the total control, simply the far better downhill experience.


        .

        Sent from my Mi Note 10 Pro using Tapatalk
        Current: '20 Spruce Slingshot 119s, '20 Spruce Crossbow 115s, '18 Spruce Osprey 132s (touring), '21 Rvl8 SII 104s, '21 Summit Invertigos 118s
        Also: '11 Allz Elaila 94s, '12 Rvl8 Rockered Condor 110s, '15 Spruce Osprey 132s , '18 Spruce Crossbow 115s
        Previous: Gaspo Hot Wax 84s, Mantrax 98s, Summit Nomad 99s, Spruce Yellow 120s, Eman Uprise 104s

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by ysb33r View Post
          I did the same route today with Ospreys. The jury is still out of which is better for ascent, but skiing back there is one clear winner - Ospreys. The no-brainer turns, the total control, simply the far better downhill experience.
          Just got my hands on a pair of Ospreys, planning to do on them the Vallée Blanche later in the season (hoping it gets to start after all) so it's very reassuring to hear your thoughts, sounds like I've made the good choice ( assuming powderish condition, otherwise I might fallback to the 125LE )

          Myself: RVL8 2015 Blunt XL, RVL8 2009 ALPdors, Spruce 125 LE, Spruce 2016 Osprey
          Daughter: Twoowt Pirania 95cm; RVL8 2010 Revolt Trees; Spruce 120 Yellow/Red

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by newbie2011 View Post
            Just got my hands on a pair of Ospreys, planning to do on them the Vallée Blanche later in the season (hoping it gets to start after all) so it's very reassuring to hear your thoughts, sounds like I've made the good choice ( assuming powderish condition, otherwise I might fallback to the 125LE )
            Maybe at some stage I could drag myself up to Alpe d'Huez. I hear they have some great black runs over there.
            Current: '20 Spruce Slingshot 119s, '20 Spruce Crossbow 115s, '18 Spruce Osprey 132s (touring), '21 Rvl8 SII 104s, '21 Summit Invertigos 118s
            Also: '11 Allz Elaila 94s, '12 Rvl8 Rockered Condor 110s, '15 Spruce Osprey 132s , '18 Spruce Crossbow 115s
            Previous: Gaspo Hot Wax 84s, Mantrax 98s, Summit Nomad 99s, Spruce Yellow 120s, Eman Uprise 104s

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by ysb33r View Post
              Maybe at some stage I could drag myself up to Alpe d'Huez. I hear they have some great black runs over there.
              I would say definitely worth the trip. I was there as a beginner skiboarder,, teaching my daughter, so not many blacks at the time, only the "must have" Sarenne, but there are several others, some nice reds as well, and a short distance away there's Les Deux Alpes, if one runs out of challenging runs. and I think La Grave is somehow in the middle, as an extra bonus
              I should get back there myself sooner than later
              Myself: RVL8 2015 Blunt XL, RVL8 2009 ALPdors, Spruce 125 LE, Spruce 2016 Osprey
              Daughter: Twoowt Pirania 95cm; RVL8 2010 Revolt Trees; Spruce 120 Yellow/Red

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by newbie2011 View Post
                I would say definitely worth the trip. I was there as a beginner skiboarder,, teaching my daughter, so not many blacks at the time, only the "must have" Sarenne, but there are several others, some nice reds as well, and a short distance away there's Les Deux Alpes, if one runs out of challenging runs. and I think La Grave is somehow in the middle, as an extra bonus
                I should get back there myself sooner than later
                Maybe we should arrange a trip

                Sent from my Mi Note 10 Pro using Tapatalk

                Current: '20 Spruce Slingshot 119s, '20 Spruce Crossbow 115s, '18 Spruce Osprey 132s (touring), '21 Rvl8 SII 104s, '21 Summit Invertigos 118s
                Also: '11 Allz Elaila 94s, '12 Rvl8 Rockered Condor 110s, '15 Spruce Osprey 132s , '18 Spruce Crossbow 115s
                Previous: Gaspo Hot Wax 84s, Mantrax 98s, Summit Nomad 99s, Spruce Yellow 120s, Eman Uprise 104s

                Comment


                • #23
                  Continuing the experiment with backcountry skiboards vs touring skis, we shot some video of the last couple of days w.r.t traversing icy slopes. Getting a glide on the slope was hard due the icy nature, so the skis are lifted more and kicked in harder. (A more experienced tourer will probably do better).

                  First video is done with touring skis. The skis do a decent job on the traverse. There is a bit more hold, but notice that it even slips on a very icy section.

                  https://ysb33r.tumblr.com/post/63784...normal-touring

                  Second video is with Ospreys using the older flat riser. The movement is a bit more precarious and there is slippage at the same spot as the touring skis. There is more kicking involved to get the edge to stick and movement is a bit slower. I addition, note how much of the skin is visible in places. This is due to the effort to angle enough of the edge into the slope

                  A beautiful thing to see, though, is how the skiboard flexes under the conditions, but the boot remains perpendicular to the fall line.

                  https://ysb33r.tumblr.com/post/63784...-spruce-osprey

                  Third video is with the same Ospreys and Voile crampons. There is a bit more skiboard lifting going on due the static fit of the ski crampon, but notice how well it bites. There is no slippage at all and whilst the one crampon is engaged, the other can be completely lifted out.

                  https://ysb33r.tumblr.com/post/63784...prey-skiboards
                  Current: '20 Spruce Slingshot 119s, '20 Spruce Crossbow 115s, '18 Spruce Osprey 132s (touring), '21 Rvl8 SII 104s, '21 Summit Invertigos 118s
                  Also: '11 Allz Elaila 94s, '12 Rvl8 Rockered Condor 110s, '15 Spruce Osprey 132s , '18 Spruce Crossbow 115s
                  Previous: Gaspo Hot Wax 84s, Mantrax 98s, Summit Nomad 99s, Spruce Yellow 120s, Eman Uprise 104s

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Very nice videos demonstrating how well fixed crampons work in giving security in this kind of traverse. As you have pointed out , I do feel that skiboards because they are fatter and shorter tend to need crampons earlier then touring skis. Once fitted with crampons they can traverse icy slopes pretty well . Glad the voile crampons worked out for you !
                    Boards :
                    Blunt Xl, DLP, Spliff, Condor, Rockered Condor , Slingshot, Sherpa, Icelantic Shaman
                    Boots
                    K2 BFC 100 Grip walk sole , Dynafit CR Radical AT boot, Ride Insano Snowboard boots
                    Bindings:
                    Zero Pro Non release Binding
                    Modified Receptor Backcountry Bindings (Bill Version and Slow Version)
                    Spruce Riser with Attack 14 GW /AT binding
                    Custom Risers with Fritschi Backcountry Bindings (Jeff Singer version 1, Bill version)
                    Rocker and Sbol Soft Boot Bindings.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by ysb33r View Post
                      Maybe we should arrange a trip
                      Good idea ! I tentatively wish to get some days in January if possible, one of the school holidays weeks I'll likely be in the Grand Massif, and hopefully some more days in March. Only school holidays is fixed, the rest is up for debate. If you haven't changed number from a couple of years back, I should still have your contact
                      Myself: RVL8 2015 Blunt XL, RVL8 2009 ALPdors, Spruce 125 LE, Spruce 2016 Osprey
                      Daughter: Twoowt Pirania 95cm; RVL8 2010 Revolt Trees; Spruce 120 Yellow/Red

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        This season is definitely turning into an experiment for backcountry skiboarding. This week I visited Telemark Pyrenees, a shop in Ax les Thermes run by a lovely couple. It has a bunch of backcountry gear and most of it can be obtained via mail order. I got them to cut a pair of Gecko skins in such a way that they will fit both the Spruce Crossbows and the Spruce Slingshots. These Gecko skins are Austrian made and glue-less. We went through a selection of skins in the shop before deciding on these.

                        Click image for larger version

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                        The Pomoco skins (in picture left-top) were not available in a configuration that really suited cutting it down to the length that would be required. The Black Diamond ones (top-right) looked good and it does come with a basic cutter, although not a smart as the one from Pomoco. In the end I decided the Geckos would be an interested option, because they are glue-less and the owner has been using them for a number of years. The skin-side itself is mohair-nylon mix.

                        The skins clips to the front and the back with plastic buckles, which can also be purchases separately. The back is then tightened using the strap.

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                        That being done I went on to remove the older flat riser + Tyrolia Ambition bindings from the older model of Ospreys that I have and putting them on the Crossbows center-mounted. Here they are compared to the Ospreys.

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                        ONe thing with this move what I was concerned about is that hitting bumps at speed or taking small jumps could be an issue. On the Ospreys I found some impressions at the front and the back where the mounting screws of the bindings touched the board.
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                        For this reason I was not going to do anything like that as I wanted to see how well the Crossbows would do for touring in general. For a starter I shaved off 250g per leg because the Crossbows are lighter than the Ospreys. Overall my theory is that the Crossbows should outperform the Ospreys because the former have a longer running length (eventhough shorter than the Ospreys). Also the tips are higher which should be able to compensate for the reduction in rocker.
                        Attached Files
                        Current: '20 Spruce Slingshot 119s, '20 Spruce Crossbow 115s, '18 Spruce Osprey 132s (touring), '21 Rvl8 SII 104s, '21 Summit Invertigos 118s
                        Also: '11 Allz Elaila 94s, '12 Rvl8 Rockered Condor 110s, '15 Spruce Osprey 132s , '18 Spruce Crossbow 115s
                        Previous: Gaspo Hot Wax 84s, Mantrax 98s, Summit Nomad 99s, Spruce Yellow 120s, Eman Uprise 104s

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Having set up the backcountry Crossbows, it was time to test them out. Luckily we had a good dumping of snow yesterday , so there was a good mix of pow, cut-up tracks and some icy patches in the shade. Safest was to test in-resort and I was off my local hill which is still closed to lift-based skiing. As per usual I hit the 4km/1000m ascent.

                          Climbing:

                          I immediately noticed that being on the Crossbows felt more nimble. This could partially be down to the new skins as well, but overall I felt I climbed easier. It did feel slightly stranger climbing on something this short compared to touring skis or Ospreys, but that shortly disappeared. On the way up I only really found about two small stretches of hardpack / icy sections, but here I felt more comfortable on the forward glide. Once again some of this could be down to skins, but I never felt any side slippage. Most of the route though was either making a track in 10cm snow of following a skitrack.

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                          Downhill:

                          A lot of people of touring skis just ski down the same route that they walk up. I however, decided to hit one of my favourite black runs - Tub del Coll. I did not hit the bottom chute on it as I left it for a snowboarder I was chatting to on top. I left him that part untracked and opted for the open space instead. Anyway the Crossbow cut through the deep snow without a problem, just as I thought. What a joy and what way to outperform the Ospreys. Further down on the flatter section I hit some hard, icy patches in between variable snow. Once again the Crossbows cut through everything and noisily disposed of the icy sections. Never did I feel like losing my balance when the terrain changed even with carrying a laden backpack. The last section was a lot of cut up snow and it was a fun playground.


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                          (The skitrack to the left is mine descending just above the chute that completes the Tub de Coll run).

                          Conclusion:

                          As I suspected, the Crossbows outperformed the Ospreys in all aspects. Maybe this will be different for a heavier rider, but for me a can see a clear winner. I can just imagine skiing trees with friend on touring skis...

                          What's next?
                          • Test the using the 5cm setback
                          • Test traversing icy slopes using the Tyrolia crampons (cannot use the Voiles atm).
                          • Repeat all tests using Slingshots.
                          • Maybe come up with a riser that works with hybrid tech-pin binding and a crampon.
                          Current: '20 Spruce Slingshot 119s, '20 Spruce Crossbow 115s, '18 Spruce Osprey 132s (touring), '21 Rvl8 SII 104s, '21 Summit Invertigos 118s
                          Also: '11 Allz Elaila 94s, '12 Rvl8 Rockered Condor 110s, '15 Spruce Osprey 132s , '18 Spruce Crossbow 115s
                          Previous: Gaspo Hot Wax 84s, Mantrax 98s, Summit Nomad 99s, Spruce Yellow 120s, Eman Uprise 104s

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            I've ordered several times from Telemark Pyrenees, found them very reliable and trustworthy, are one of my favourite online sports shops.

                            Nice feedback on the Crossbows, was not expecting to be so clear ahead of the Ospreys on the downhill, looking forward to hearing your report on the Slingshots, who are apparently better than the Crossbows.

                            And it looks like you're lucky, minutes ago I've read Andorra will open this Saturday !
                            Myself: RVL8 2015 Blunt XL, RVL8 2009 ALPdors, Spruce 125 LE, Spruce 2016 Osprey
                            Daughter: Twoowt Pirania 95cm; RVL8 2010 Revolt Trees; Spruce 120 Yellow/Red

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by newbie2011 View Post
                              Nice feedback on the Crossbows, was not expecting to be so clear ahead of the Ospreys on the downhill, looking forward to hearing your report on the Slingshots, who are apparently better than the Crossbows.
                              I would not say they are better, just slightly different profiles. Both are awesome. I just prefer the Slingshots a bit more as I think I can induce turns from the ankle a little easier - something to do with the assymetric tail. That is why I suspect they would work just nicely for touring.

                              Originally posted by newbie2011 View Post
                              And it looks like you're lucky, minutes ago I've read Andorra will open this Saturday !
                              Only for residents and only a number of pistes. But good news anyway.
                              Current: '20 Spruce Slingshot 119s, '20 Spruce Crossbow 115s, '18 Spruce Osprey 132s (touring), '21 Rvl8 SII 104s, '21 Summit Invertigos 118s
                              Also: '11 Allz Elaila 94s, '12 Rvl8 Rockered Condor 110s, '15 Spruce Osprey 132s , '18 Spruce Crossbow 115s
                              Previous: Gaspo Hot Wax 84s, Mantrax 98s, Summit Nomad 99s, Spruce Yellow 120s, Eman Uprise 104s

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                I was out today testing touring on Crossbows again. This time with 5cm setback. Conditions were pretty much the same as yesterday, but with less untracked snow.

                                I found climbing with setback slightly more laborious and there were some steep sections where I did not get as much grip as I would have liked. I think with setback there is a section at the front where the skin does not have enough force to engage. Possibly when touring on setback, more kick-turns will be required.

                                On descent I found some nice pockets of deep snow. Here the setback did help, but I am not convinced that it is a major enough factor to continue touring on setback.

                                One I hit some harder snow, I could feel that setback does respond well to turns, but not as nice as center mount.

                                So far I'm leaning towards center-mount, but there is no reason (besides changing in a cold, windy spot) not to switch to setback in tge transit zone.

                                Sent from my Mi Note 10 Pro using Tapatalk

                                Current: '20 Spruce Slingshot 119s, '20 Spruce Crossbow 115s, '18 Spruce Osprey 132s (touring), '21 Rvl8 SII 104s, '21 Summit Invertigos 118s
                                Also: '11 Allz Elaila 94s, '12 Rvl8 Rockered Condor 110s, '15 Spruce Osprey 132s , '18 Spruce Crossbow 115s
                                Previous: Gaspo Hot Wax 84s, Mantrax 98s, Summit Nomad 99s, Spruce Yellow 120s, Eman Uprise 104s

                                Comment

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