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Full Tilt Booter, Stock Zero Binding - A Backcountry Review and Trip Report

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  • Full Tilt Booter, Stock Zero Binding - A Backcountry Review and Trip Report

    There has been some confusion about my comments about the touring binding application that has been developed for non release skiboard bindings. Some folks are getting the impression that I think the binding is lacking or prone to pre release or needs further development. On the contrary .. yes I am a perfectionist and I want this binding to do everything ... but no I do not think skiboarders need to wait for the development of the perfect touring binding .. you can go out right now and have a magnificent time at very low cost .. I have tried snowshoes.... they are ok , but the touring binding is better... I have tried the Fritschi binding and telemark bindings and they have had a long development time and work well.. but nothing , absolutely nothing beats the pure joy I have had this season on a pure and simple skiboard solution to backcountry touring . Skiboarding is all about simplicity and the touring binding is all that .. , Today I was on Full Tilt booters , and stock Zero skiboard binding rigged with a simple telemark cable binding and skins and having the time of my life .. Will I use Fritschis again? , no , will I use snowshoes ,no ? , will I use telemark bindings no.?. I am a skiboarder and I will use skiboard bindings rigged with simple touring cables and skins to access the goods. Proud of the simplicity , and proud of the versatility that my skiboards and skiboard bindings provide ..

    But I am getting ahead of myself ... let's go get the goods ... a foot of fresh pow 2 days ago ... my buddy Billy and myself go get the goods today ... untracked snow and no people 2 days after a storm .. the ski areas are a zoo yesterday and today ... no way are we going there ... this is why we are here !

    Billy breaking trail on his Hagan 130 's


    On the trail , me with a view of Pyramid peak in the background .. Billy and I have climbed that mountain and descended it in the past .. maybe some other day ...today we have found paradise in the trees...



    Silence , nobody else here , new pow , blue bird sky ... I am a very happy man ... not the least because I am here on skiboards ,on sweet Full tilt boots , my Condors, my standard skiboard bindings.. , skins and vapor light telemark cables , a total low weight rig , that serves all my needs ,better then anything I have every used in the backcountry ..



    Transitions are a piece of cake . snap off my telemark cables , reverse my skiboards so the heel piece which used to be the toe piece , is now the heel piece, lock in and strip off skins ...



    Locked and loaded and ready to shred some pow ... oh better put on my helmet ! ! the Revel8 stickers willl give me good luck !



    Here is some vid of Billy and I having fun in the pow ... Magic day .. !



    Boards :
    Spliffs
    Condors
    Crossbows
    Sherpa

    Boot:
    K2 BFC 100

    Bindings:
    Zero Pro Non release Binding
    Modified Receptor Backcountry Bindings (Bill Version and Slow Version)
    Spruce ProPrime Plus Binding/Riser with Attack 13 GW binding
    Custom Risers with Fritschi Backcountry Bindings (Jeff Singer version 1, Bill version)

  • #2
    Amazing place you got there. Here, we've got rain, wind, and in a few days, mid-50 degree weather.

    Comment


    • #3
      Oh I got so excited I forgot the review!

      Full tilt booter
      Perfect backcountry skiboard boot ... extremely light weight , I removed the rear forward lean plastic piece so could have a more upright stance... leave all the buckles undone for climbing nice and comfy for the climb ..
      lock all the buckles for the descent and have full on ski area boot control for the descent ... just the perfect backcountry boot !

      zero stock binding ..

      The zero has a very large diameter heel bale and lets me use the heel bale as a toe bale for the Full tilts ... it also will fit any other downhill ski boots as a toe bale .. using the heel bale as a toe bale is a stroke of genius suggested by Skafreak and helps to prevent premature release of the binding and also puts the climber in a front ward position ( if you use a set back as I do ) .. the front ward position was magic for trail breaking ....

      also the Zero front bales / front lever, can be used nicely as heel elevators and help also as heel locators and help to prevent torqueing of the boot when pared with telemark cables


      Here is a pic of the Full tilts in the Zero binding locked with telemark cables and the zero front bale used as a heel lift .


      By changing the positon of the front bale you have two positions of heel lift


      Here is a detail pic of the zero front bale in high position heel elevator mode


      and in low position heel elevator mode



      Skiboards RULE in the backcountry ... set up your own touring set up and go get some !!!!
      Boards :
      Spliffs
      Condors
      Crossbows
      Sherpa

      Boot:
      K2 BFC 100

      Bindings:
      Zero Pro Non release Binding
      Modified Receptor Backcountry Bindings (Bill Version and Slow Version)
      Spruce ProPrime Plus Binding/Riser with Attack 13 GW binding
      Custom Risers with Fritschi Backcountry Bindings (Jeff Singer version 1, Bill version)

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by jjue View Post
        zero stock binding ..

        The zero has a very large diameter heel bale and lets me use the heel bale as a toe bale for the Full tilts ... it also will fit any other downhill ski boots as a toe bale .. using the heel bale as a toe bale is a stroke of genius suggested by Skafreak and helps to prevent premature release of the binding and also puts the climber in a front ward position ( if you use a set back as I do ) .. the front ward position was magic for trail breaking ....

        also the Zero heel bales can be used nicely as heel elevators and help also as heel locators and help to prevent torqueing of the boot when pared with telemark cables
        Hi Jack,

        Thanks for clarifying. It was getting confusing trying to keep up with the developments.

        Do the receptors also allow the use of the heel bale as the a toe bale with your FT boots?
        sigpic


        Osprey, Sherpa, Custom Coda 120WT, Custom DS110, Condor (Green), Spliff

        Custom Twist Out duck foot bindings, Bombers (custom duck foot base plate and 3 pads), releasable S810ti on custom duck foot riser

        Nordica N3 NXT ski boots (best so far)


        Wife: 104 SII & 100 Blunt XL with S810ti bindings on custom "adjustable duck foot" risers

        Loaners: 125LE, 105 EMP, 101 KTP, 100 Blunt XL, 98 Slapdash, 88 Blunts

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by slow View Post
          Hi Jack,

          Thanks for clarifying. It was getting confusing trying to keep up with the developments.

          Do the receptors also allow the use of the heel bale as the a toe bale with your FT boots?
          the receptor heel bale is too small to be used as a toe bale for any ski boots ...
          i used a line ff pro heel bale in the receptor binding it fits all regular ski boots as a toe bale except for the Full tilt ..
          the only current standard heel bale that can be used as a toe bale for Full tilt boots are the Zeros which have a very wide heel bale ....
          Boards :
          Spliffs
          Condors
          Crossbows
          Sherpa

          Boot:
          K2 BFC 100

          Bindings:
          Zero Pro Non release Binding
          Modified Receptor Backcountry Bindings (Bill Version and Slow Version)
          Spruce ProPrime Plus Binding/Riser with Attack 13 GW binding
          Custom Risers with Fritschi Backcountry Bindings (Jeff Singer version 1, Bill version)

          Comment


          • #6
            Thanks for sorting that out. I did not realize that you had a ff pro bale on the Receptor.
            sigpic


            Osprey, Sherpa, Custom Coda 120WT, Custom DS110, Condor (Green), Spliff

            Custom Twist Out duck foot bindings, Bombers (custom duck foot base plate and 3 pads), releasable S810ti on custom duck foot riser

            Nordica N3 NXT ski boots (best so far)


            Wife: 104 SII & 100 Blunt XL with S810ti bindings on custom "adjustable duck foot" risers

            Loaners: 125LE, 105 EMP, 101 KTP, 100 Blunt XL, 98 Slapdash, 88 Blunts

            Comment


            • #7
              Snow depth looks like about the same as our Mount Rose day? Perfect. Hoping my Condors will arrive in the next few days, then I will be chasing you Jack!
              Crossbow (go to dream board)
              Most everything else over time.
              Go Android

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by valmorel View Post
                Snow depth looks like about the same as our Mount Rose day? Perfect. Hoping my Condors will arrive in the next few days, then I will be chasing you Jack!
                Yes . Valmorel .. speed through the snow was about the same as Mt Rose day ... interesteing this thing about snow ... we had a storm 2 days before , pretty much similar to the storm we had before our shredfest backcountry day , , , but the snow had had time to set up , so was denser then the shredfest backcountry day and provided more support and more speed . lots of fun ! you will love those Condors , Valmorel , they are crazy fun , especially in pow and junk and crud ... and not bad on the groomers as well ....
                Boards :
                Spliffs
                Condors
                Crossbows
                Sherpa

                Boot:
                K2 BFC 100

                Bindings:
                Zero Pro Non release Binding
                Modified Receptor Backcountry Bindings (Bill Version and Slow Version)
                Spruce ProPrime Plus Binding/Riser with Attack 13 GW binding
                Custom Risers with Fritschi Backcountry Bindings (Jeff Singer version 1, Bill version)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by jjue View Post
                  you will love those Condors , Valmorel , they are crazy fun , especially in pow and junk and crud ... and not bad on the groomers as well ....
                  Condors reached UK. Just waiting to hear they have reached local depot (probably tomorrow). Provisionally booked Xscape for Sunday.
                  Crossbow (go to dream board)
                  Most everything else over time.
                  Go Android

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Tweaking the Zero touring binding

                    For those using the Zero as the base binding for touring applications here are a couple of simple suggestions to improve touring function

                    1/ i use a small piece of thin rubber sheeting in the heel bale slot to allow the heel bale to stand up by itself .. this is really useful in transitions where it is easier getting into heel bale when used as a toe bale for touring , or used as a heel bale in the descent..




                    2/ I install a wood screw just in front of the front lever of the binding , this allows the front lever not to be kicked down while climbing and allows the lever to stay in place well as a climbing bar in the low position .. in the high position the lever is braced by the serrations in the front bale binding base plate .



                    Boards :
                    Spliffs
                    Condors
                    Crossbows
                    Sherpa

                    Boot:
                    K2 BFC 100

                    Bindings:
                    Zero Pro Non release Binding
                    Modified Receptor Backcountry Bindings (Bill Version and Slow Version)
                    Spruce ProPrime Plus Binding/Riser with Attack 13 GW binding
                    Custom Risers with Fritschi Backcountry Bindings (Jeff Singer version 1, Bill version)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Comparison Kong Grimper binding vs Touring Skiboard binding

                      A couple of proprietary skiboard touring bindings have been developed ... which are based on the principle of a non release skiboard binding mounted on free pivoting base plate , the base plate is moved forward for climbing and then backwards for descent ..

                      Here is a diagram of the Kong Grimper system


                      Here is a description of how it works . ...


                      Instructions


                      1.
                      Fix your boot onto the binding, locking it by the plate B. Warning: do not over tight the plate because it may cause a bending.

                      2.
                      To climbing a gentle slope, loosen the screw A and move the binding to the front end, then lock again the screw. In this case, the steel tip C is kept in the closed position.


                      3.
                      Climbing a steep slope, you may open the stainless steel tip C. The tip will lean against the nylon plate D fixed on the ski.

                      4.
                      Willing to lock the heel during the descent, loosen the screw A and move the binding to the back end, blocking it into the grip E.

                      The really cool thing about the idea of reversing a regular skiboard binding with a set back and using the heel bale as a toe bale , is that we accomplish the same thing as a moveable plate binding just by turning our skiboard around during transitions . In climbing position we are forward on the skiboard and for descent we are set back .Also we can press in to service different parts of the regular skiboard binding for different roles.. Such as the use of the front lever as a climbing assist heel elevator . It is really a unique feature of the design of regular non release skiboard bindings to allow this type of touring binding without the need to buy a proprietary binding system and is a special feature of a skiboarding as a winter mountaineering sport.
                      Boards :
                      Spliffs
                      Condors
                      Crossbows
                      Sherpa

                      Boot:
                      K2 BFC 100

                      Bindings:
                      Zero Pro Non release Binding
                      Modified Receptor Backcountry Bindings (Bill Version and Slow Version)
                      Spruce ProPrime Plus Binding/Riser with Attack 13 GW binding
                      Custom Risers with Fritschi Backcountry Bindings (Jeff Singer version 1, Bill version)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Past and present

                        The use of short skis and skiboards in the backcountry amongst climbers has a long history Lowell Skoog was one of the pioneers ... here is a recent thread amongst cascade climbers with pics ... The only problem with the Condor/Zero set up , is that the use of the heel bale as a toe bale cannot be used with standard mountaineering boots because of the width of mountaineering boot toes .. it could be used however , in my original design with the front bale used as the front bale for touring applications ...

                        http://cascadeclimbers.com/forum/ubb...escent_skis_fi

                        Standard skiboard bindings could be used with the heel bale as a toe bale for mountaineering type boots by fashioning some wider heel bales .. the size of the skiboard would be the limiting factor as to which boots could be used to drive what skiboards.. in my experience standard plastic mountaineering boots would be too soft to drive a real big skiboard like the Condor ..
                        Boards :
                        Spliffs
                        Condors
                        Crossbows
                        Sherpa

                        Boot:
                        K2 BFC 100

                        Bindings:
                        Zero Pro Non release Binding
                        Modified Receptor Backcountry Bindings (Bill Version and Slow Version)
                        Spruce ProPrime Plus Binding/Riser with Attack 13 GW binding
                        Custom Risers with Fritschi Backcountry Bindings (Jeff Singer version 1, Bill version)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          So why do mountaineering boots have a wide toe?
                          sigpic


                          Osprey, Sherpa, Custom Coda 120WT, Custom DS110, Condor (Green), Spliff

                          Custom Twist Out duck foot bindings, Bombers (custom duck foot base plate and 3 pads), releasable S810ti on custom duck foot riser

                          Nordica N3 NXT ski boots (best so far)


                          Wife: 104 SII & 100 Blunt XL with S810ti bindings on custom "adjustable duck foot" risers

                          Loaners: 125LE, 105 EMP, 101 KTP, 100 Blunt XL, 98 Slapdash, 88 Blunts

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by slow View Post
                            So why do mountaineering boots have a wide toe?
                            alpine touring boots, mountaineering boots , are constructed more like hiking boots with a wider toe box then regular ski boots which have a narrower last in the front ... i assume that regular ski boots are constructed that way because of the narrow din standard front sole .. .and the other boots are constructed more like regular shoes ..
                            Boards :
                            Spliffs
                            Condors
                            Crossbows
                            Sherpa

                            Boot:
                            K2 BFC 100

                            Bindings:
                            Zero Pro Non release Binding
                            Modified Receptor Backcountry Bindings (Bill Version and Slow Version)
                            Spruce ProPrime Plus Binding/Riser with Attack 13 GW binding
                            Custom Risers with Fritschi Backcountry Bindings (Jeff Singer version 1, Bill version)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by jjue View Post
                              the receptor heel bale is too small to be used as a toe bale for any ski boots ...
                              i used a line ff pro heel bale in the receptor binding it fits all regular ski boots as a toe bale except for the Full tilt ..
                              the only current standard heel bale that can be used as a toe bale for Full tilt boots are the Zeros which have a very wide heel bale ....
                              Jack, do you find that the wider, larger-radius heel bales on the zeros hold securely enough...without side-to-side play...as toe and/or heel bales?

                              If you take a look at the pictures of skyskater's bindings, he uses a straight rod as a heel bale which would be the ultimate "fit-anything" bale but I imagine might have too much side-play or not enough contact area for your demanding application? I've been playing with custom bale configurations and trying to figure out a solution.

                              Comment

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