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A Case for the 2018 RVL8 Chronic

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  • A Case for the 2018 RVL8 Chronic

    First we had the Mary Janes and Blunts, then the Blunt XLs followed by the Spliffs and the Sticky Icky Ickies. The next logical progression for the RVL8 R&D department is the RVL8 Chronic. Or maybe it can be called the 4:20s, Danks, etc.. but whatever they are called here is my suggestion for the DNA of the next RVL8 creation.

    DISCLAIMER: We are heading into territory over 110cm so grab your release bindings if you want to follow.

    The skiboarding community, regardless of rider age, will always embody a fun, youthful attitude but as even the original core riders age there seems to be quest to find a longer skiboard that will provide an easier ride but still hold on to the minimalistic core values of the sport. With Spruce Mountain Skiboards out of the new longboard development game I would suggest it's time for RVL8 to bring a longer skiboard to the market the combines all the awesome parts of the RVL8 line up.

    Here is my suggestion for what we will from here on out refer to as the "Chronic Project"
    • Length: 115cm
    • Sidecut: 14.2/11.8/14.2 (essentially halfway between the Spliff and Stick Icky Icky)
    • Rocker/Camber/Rocker: 2/80 at the tip and tail (same as the SIIs) with the added length in the center increasing the camber to 8mm giving them a camber similar to the 120s or the Revolts
    • Sidewall construction: The same ABS Sidewalls as the SIIs with the topsheet chamfer that they seem to have.
    • Inserts: 4x10 centered inserts with a 3cm setback option
    • Bases: Neon Green ISOSPEED Sintered 7500 Race Base so they glow when seen from below the lifts
    • Top Sheets: Reflective Chrome Diamond Plate Topsheets with RVL8 logo on the tips -- keep it simple but flashy!
    • Other details: Signature RVL8 Blunt Tips and Tails and medium stiff flex (stiffer than the 120s and softer than KTPs)


    Anyone interested in this endeavor? Anyone willing to commit to a prototype preorder so Greco knows there will be limited risk in bringing these to market? Let me know your thoughts .... this is probably the only snow sliding community that has a direct line to the top supplier and can influence what we are all riding next season.
    17
    Sign me up! I would invest now to help develop prototypes.
    41.18%
    7
    I'm interested but want others to try before I buy a pair.
    17.65%
    3
    No thanks. I'm happy with my current skiboards.
    35.29%
    6
    I'm interested but only if these are 110cm or shorter so I can use non-release bindings.
    5.88%
    1
    Boards:
    2016 Spruce tuned Head Jr. Caddys - 131cm
    2013 Spruce "CTS" 120s
    2010 Spruce "Yellow/Red" 120s
    2018 Spruce "CTS" Crossbows - 115cm
    2016 RVL8 Spliffs - 109cm
    2008 RVL8 Revolt "City" - 105cm
    2017 RVL8 Sticky Icky Icky - 104cm
    2011 Defiance Blades - 101cm

  • #2
    Scr?

    Wookie, using your proposed specs, what would the SCR be? If it's at least 8m, I will beg, borrow and/or steal to be able to get in on the proto list.

    P.S. This is kinda creepy. In the last couple of days I've been thinking about contacting Greco to get his thoughts on something very similar to this, to see if he's open to the idea of building something that would require a Spruce riser setup.

    P.S.S. I would go with a ww closer to 13cm for increased float. (Maybe there can be wide and not-so-wide versions)
    Last edited by Fedfan; 01-02-2017, 05:57 PM. Reason: Added final paragraph
    171cm/190lbs
    Current Favorites:
    RVL8 Yin/Yang Blunts, Spruce Sherpas (x2) & Ospreys, Coda custom Yetis v1 140
    Spruce Pro Primes w/Attack 13's (x 4), Bomber Elite 1
    Other boards I'm trying:
    Summit Custom Carbon 110, Dynastar Twin 85, Coda custom Yetis v2 145

    Comment


    • #3
      I kind of don't have an option in your poll.

      I'm not personally interested in such a board, but would certainly support the production of any new product from RVL8. The overall health of the sport is dependent on new products to capture our imagination and help grow our rider base. So, in an odd way, I would be an investor but not a customer.

      Wookie, is this similar to the Blunt XXL we used to fantasize about?
      Just these, nothing else !

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Fedfan View Post
        Wookie, using your proposed specs, what would the SCR be? If it's at least 8m, I will beg, borrow and/or steal to be able to get in on the proto list.
        I was thinking somewhere between 7.5 & 8.5m -- I am spit-balling the specs so not sure what adjustments would be needed to get into that sweetspot.

        Originally posted by Fedfan View Post
        P.S. This is kinda creepy. In the last couple of days I've been thinking about contacting Greco to get his thoughts on something very similar to this, to see if he's open to the idea of building something that would require a Spruce riser setup.
        Me too -- hence the post. I was thinking given the size of our sport it would be more cost effective to crowdsource prototype funding. If you can get 5-10 riders to front the prototype cost for the first small run then you can bring a new skiboard to market with minimal cost and risk shared by that small group of riders.

        Originally posted by Fedfan View Post
        P.S.S. I would go with a ww closer to 13cm for increased float. (Maybe there can be wide and not-so-wide versions)
        And here is the problem with crowdsourcing .... we all want something different. At 13.0cm under foot this is too wide for the hardpack conditions I ride. I need to bust crud but don't always need float in powder. I think if a rider wants width to get float there is a weath of choices (RC, Condors, Spliffs, Blunts, Blunt XLs) the market lacks a rocker/camber/rocker cruising long board.

        Originally posted by Bad Wolf View Post
        I kind of don't have an option in your poll.

        I'm not personally interested in such a board, but would certainly support the production of any new product from RVL8. The overall health of the sport is dependent on new products to capture our imagination and help grow our rider base. So, in an odd way, I would be an investor but not a customer.
        Sorry, I hadn't thought of that and can't figure out how to edit the poll. Maybe this can be like a RVL8 Kickstarter campaign.

        $10 - gets you good karma
        $20 - gets you good karma + a RVL8 sticker pack
        $50 - gets you a RVL8 t-shirt
        $350 - gets you a set of prototypes
        $10,000 - gets you a set of protos & Valmorel as your personal proper British butler for a week. (Where's my checkbook?)


        Originally posted by Bad Wolf View Post
        Wookie, is this similar to the Blunt XXL we used to fantasize about?
        Yes and No -- It would be more accurate to call this an updated Spruce 120 or a Sticky XXL or the unholy blending of every board in the RVL8 line-up. I am thinking a board between 110 and 120 with a narrower profile than the Blunts. A board more geared for resort cruising, carving, and light powder. This would be a skiboard but would meet the goals that many riders are trying to find with the various mini skis. Perhaps a better name for this is "Purgatory" as it exists in a halfway state between skis and skiboards or "Goldilocks" because its just right. It might be closer to the DS110 that was once messed with but would bring rocker into the construction.
        Boards:
        2016 Spruce tuned Head Jr. Caddys - 131cm
        2013 Spruce "CTS" 120s
        2010 Spruce "Yellow/Red" 120s
        2018 Spruce "CTS" Crossbows - 115cm
        2016 RVL8 Spliffs - 109cm
        2008 RVL8 Revolt "City" - 105cm
        2017 RVL8 Sticky Icky Icky - 104cm
        2011 Defiance Blades - 101cm

        Comment


        • #5
          I'm in

          Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
          Crossbow (go to dream board)
          Most everything else over time.
          Go Android

          Comment


          • #6
            In the pursuit of Goldilocks...

            I guess I didn't understand. You're not looking for ideas necessarily? I thought maybe you were just throwing something out there to see what tweaks others might suggest.

            I like your idea, as long as the SCR is at least 8m and the length at least 115cm. And the setback option and riser requirement are winners, too, in my mind. You're thinking of a super Spliff/Icky hybrid (East Coast?), whereas maybe I'm thinking of a super Spliff with a longer SCR (West Coast?). What got me going were the Yetis I got from FFA (I love'em!) last year. Just going by the numbers/specs on the Spliffs, I got the impression the Yetis (at 140cm, 13.5cm waist, 5-point 10m SCR and rocker for days) might be an XXXXXXXL Spliff. I was thinking of a 115-120cm version of that.

            Bottom line: I'm on board with your idea. If this works, I'll campaign for the super Spliff next.
            171cm/190lbs
            Current Favorites:
            RVL8 Yin/Yang Blunts, Spruce Sherpas (x2) & Ospreys, Coda custom Yetis v1 140
            Spruce Pro Primes w/Attack 13's (x 4), Bomber Elite 1
            Other boards I'm trying:
            Summit Custom Carbon 110, Dynastar Twin 85, Coda custom Yetis v2 145

            Comment


            • #7
              I'm IN with a pre-investment for a set of proto-types!

              But not all in for the butler

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Fedfan View Post
                I guess I didn't understand. You're not looking for ideas necessarily? I thought maybe you were just throwing something out there to see what tweaks others might suggest.
                Certainly fine with ideas, feedback, etc.. I was just commenting that most of these hypothetical "community input" board threads breakdown because we all want something slightly different. If this ends up going forward with a compromise on the specs I would still be in.

                Originally posted by Fedfan View Post
                I like your idea, as long as the SCR is at least 8m and the length at least 115cm. And the setback option and riser requirement are winners, too, in my mind. You're thinking of a super Spliff/Icky hybrid (East Coast?)...
                Yup. Thinking of a Super Icky. The Spliff width can be tough on hardpack so the thought was to keep it narrower than the Spliff for hardpack handling and stretch the length out to around 115cm+ to get the extra float needed for powder with the length. I am really enjoying the narrow Sticky Icky Icky this season after several seasons of riding wider skiboards.


                Originally posted by Fedfan View Post
                ....whereas maybe I'm thinking of a super Spliff with a longer SCR (West Coast?). What got me going were the Yetis I got from FFA (I love'em!) last year. Just going by the numbers/specs on the Spliffs, I got the impression the Yetis (at 140cm, 13.5cm waist, 5-point 10m SCR and rocker for days) might be an XXXXXXXL Spliff. I was thinking of a 115-120cm version of that.
                Since I don't ride powder that much I am trying to keep it on the narrower side but add length for edge grip and float. You are right that this is a bit of the Goldilocks "just right" problem.

                Originally posted by Fedfan View Post
                Bottom line: I'm on board with your idea. If this works, I'll campaign for the super Spliff next.
                Even though I likely wouldn't push for a "super Spliff" I would support that too. Be it by just contributing to the development or being an initial prototype buyer. Over the past few seasons I have purchased boards that I have tried out and have not fallen in love with. Ultimately I have sold my trial boards for 50-80% of what I paid for them and passed the experience on to someone else. In the end I am not out all that much money for the experience (equivalent to leasing skis) so I don't mind being the test pilot and investor of new prototypes. Ultimately it's good for the sport, right?
                Boards:
                2016 Spruce tuned Head Jr. Caddys - 131cm
                2013 Spruce "CTS" 120s
                2010 Spruce "Yellow/Red" 120s
                2018 Spruce "CTS" Crossbows - 115cm
                2016 RVL8 Spliffs - 109cm
                2008 RVL8 Revolt "City" - 105cm
                2017 RVL8 Sticky Icky Icky - 104cm
                2011 Defiance Blades - 101cm

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by valmorel View Post
                  I'm in
                  Originally posted by macrophotog View Post
                  I'm IN with a pre-investment for a set of proto-types!

                  But not all in for the butler
                  Cool, with you guys plus me and Fedfan that make 4 riders that would be investor/test pilots. The question to Greco is how many would we need to make this work?

                  I am thinking this is a bit like the way J Skis is now releasing new skis where there is a limited number of protos (signed and numbered) that are offered up at the beginning of a run to get them to market, try them out, and then move forward with additional limited runs if there is interest.
                  Boards:
                  2016 Spruce tuned Head Jr. Caddys - 131cm
                  2013 Spruce "CTS" 120s
                  2010 Spruce "Yellow/Red" 120s
                  2018 Spruce "CTS" Crossbows - 115cm
                  2016 RVL8 Spliffs - 109cm
                  2008 RVL8 Revolt "City" - 105cm
                  2017 RVL8 Sticky Icky Icky - 104cm
                  2011 Defiance Blades - 101cm

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I think we need to do a better job of promoting the wide variety of boards currently available. I am counting 14 different models currently. Now, Obviously I'm coming from a different riding style than the majority of the riders on the forum, but I am having a tough time convincing myself that one of these 14 models isn't a winner. I personally have used 3:

                    -Revolts, because there was only one option in 2005
                    -ALP/DLP because you can honestly do anything with it
                    -Condor, because who doesn't mind a little extra surface area for the good days

                    I do understand the need for a few other models as far as size and rocker, but I can't look at the current selection and find any gaps in boards that meet every one of my needs as a rider.

                    Are we wanting to create to boards out of an actual need, or because we can? Or maybe this is just a discussion about our dreams? I'm sure every time Greco is making a new board, He has to pour money into protoypes, molds, and the entire design process, so having a bajilion models isnt very cost effective.

                    I love how creative this community is, but I am personally happy with the selection of boards available and to be honest, I could probably ride just revolts for the rest of my life and be happy.
                    facebook.com/dlynamr8

                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2s7yBfCTp2M

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      This are some comments to help Wookie think though what he rally wants

                      I think we should forgo "good powder capabilities" in a skiboard targeted for groomed / hardpack performance mostly. The reason is that due to the moderate width that is a must for good hardpack performance, and the short length desired (under 120cm), it ain't going to float well in powder for anyone but the lightest super-small riders. I think a slight "on-piste" type of rocker combined with moderate camber underfoot, and a smooth progressive flex pattern that would not be too soft (especially underfoot) and work well with the sidecut when on edge, would be great to have for carving as well as for busting though the piles of stuff that usually accumulates on groomed slopes after a few hours of skiing (or when they are not so well groomed to begin with). But the width should be narrow enough for effortless edging, which I think pretty much eliminates any decent powder performance ambitions for anyone over 150lb or so.

                      I also think the turning radius should be at least 8 meters, probably more, like 10-11m. I think on groomed slopes most folks will eventually graduate to making larger carving turns where you want at least 10m radius. Fighting a short turn radius when making long carving turns I could live without. That longer radius won't be a problem for skidded and other types of short turns, where the turn radius does not really matter.

                      So to Dave's question - I think we are missing a long turn radius sub-120cm groomers skiboard with some rocker-camber-rocker profile and about 11cm width or so (but not less than 10cm, so full-sized folks will feel good on it too, and no more than 12cm as that's too wide for easy edging)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Davelynam View Post
                        I love how creative this community is, but I am personally happy with the selection of boards available and to be honest, I could probably ride just revolts for the rest of my life and be happy.
                        I think part of our desire for new designs is that many of us don't have the skills to take a classic skiboard all over the mountain. We need a little extra length for fore/aft stability, more width for float, a more forgiving turn radius, a little rocker to keep the tips up, more flex to smooth out the bumps and non release bindings to save our backs and knees. Pure talent can't be replicated, but design features can help the rest of us get more out of the sport.

                        We have also marketed how easy it is to swap out boards with the 4x4 system, enabling us to have one set of bindings and a quiver of boards. I would rather be a one board rider, but I understand those who love to collect boards as well. I think what we have to do is look at how the sport is developing and what out future sales demographic will be, then make boards that target that market.
                        Just these, nothing else !

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Davelynam View Post
                          I think we need to do a better job of promoting the wide variety of boards currently available....
                          Companies either improve and evolve their products or they die. If RVL8 stopped with the Revolt because it was "good enough" Greco would have made a bunch of pairs, sold them all, and then went out of business because RVL8 offered nothing new. If the community stuck with was currently available I would not have purchased the Spliffs last season and the Stickies this season both of which provide a totally different riding experience than the Revolts, Condors, etc.

                          Originally posted by Davelynam View Post
                          Are we wanting to create to boards out of an actual need, or because we can?
                          BECAUSE WE CAN ... is there a better reason .... Does because "new is always more fun than the same old thing" sound like a better reason. Frankly most of the best experiences in my life happened just because I could do it not because I needed to it.

                          Originally posted by Davelynam View Post
                          ..... I'm sure every time Greco is making a new board, He has to pour money into protoypes, molds, and the entire design process, so having a bajilion models isnt very cost effective.
                          Ah, yes. This is exactly the point of starting this thread. What I am proposing here is an investor/test pilot relationship with RVL8. This hypothetical new board would only be created if a handful of riders were willing to invest and offset the prototype development cost that Greco would normally have to cover. So if the minimum test run is 10 sets at $400 per set we need a group of riders willing to cover that cost. You'll likely pay more than the production boards would cost but you get the privilege and fun of riding something new first. In this way the community shares the cost and the risk of bringing new designs to market.

                          Originally posted by Davelynam View Post
                          ..... I am personally happy with the selection of boards available and to be honest, I could probably ride just revolts for the rest of my life and be happy.
                          You sound a bit like the old guys in the lift lines on straight skis that think my skiboards are silly .... .... Revolts were better than MNPs ... the Chonics could be the next awesome leap forward.

                          Originally posted by Kocho View Post
                          ... some comments to help Wookie think though what he rally wants ...
                          The Wookie knows what he wants and the only person that gets to tell the Wookie that he realy wants something else is Mrs. Wookie. LOL!

                          The entire skiing community is in constant search of the mythical "All Mountain" ski ... why can't we look for the same thing. For me I am really looking to take the best of the Spruce 120, Spliff, and Stickies and create a new generation long board skiboard. I still want the tight turning radius that characterizes skiboarding to me. If I wanted a 11 or 12 cm turning radius I would just buy a pair of skis. For me running down East Coast slopes at top speed making 3 or 4 long cruising turns is no fun (aka Skiing).

                          Originally posted by Bad Wolf View Post
                          I think part of our desire for new designs is that many of us don't have the skills to take a classic skiboard all over the mountain. We need a little extra length for fore/aft stability, more width for float, a more forgiving turn radius, a little rocker to keep the tips up, more flex to smooth out the bumps and non release bindings to save our backs and knees. Pure talent can't be replicated, but design features can help the rest of us get more out of the sport.
                          Yup, this but also even the most talented rider sometimes cannot overcome their own size. Part of this is also creating a board for larger riders that isn't an uber wide clunky on hardpack skiboard or a too soft repurposed junior powder ski. If we go back to Dave's argument that we have enough already I'll counter that we no longer have the Spruce 120 or new longboards so there is a gap in the market that RVL8 can fill (or maybe I just need to have custom made).

                          Originally posted by Bad Wolf View Post
                          We have also marketed how easy it is to swap out boards with the 4x4 system, enabling us to have one set of bindings and a quiver of boards. I would rather be a one board rider, but I understand those who love to collect boards as well. I think what we have to do is look at how the sport is developing and what out future sales demographic will be, then make boards that target that market.
                          Part of this is finding another cool and fun arrow for the quiver but it's also the total opposite in that I would love to find one board that just worked 99% of the time so I don't have to swap boards.

                          Regardless of where this ends up it's a fun conversation.
                          Boards:
                          2016 Spruce tuned Head Jr. Caddys - 131cm
                          2013 Spruce "CTS" 120s
                          2010 Spruce "Yellow/Red" 120s
                          2018 Spruce "CTS" Crossbows - 115cm
                          2016 RVL8 Spliffs - 109cm
                          2008 RVL8 Revolt "City" - 105cm
                          2017 RVL8 Sticky Icky Icky - 104cm
                          2011 Defiance Blades - 101cm

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Wookie View Post
                            .The Wookie knows what he wants and the only person that gets to tell the Wookie that he realy wants something else is Mrs. Wookie. LOL!

                            The entire skiing community is in constant search of the mythical "All Mountain" ski ... why can't we look for the same thing.
                            Sure we can look for it - we won't find it. An all-mountain board to me means a board that will handle all conditions. For a skiboard (as opposed a longer ski) I think this is a hopeless task and would result in disappointment from the results. Even if a skiboard could cope with most conditions to some degree, it won't be particularly good at anything. That, I don't want or need, but I can understand if others want it as a quiver of 1 board and are happy to live with the necessary sub-par performance in most conditions (vs. a board optimized for a narrower range of conditions). If you were indeed describing such a board, that is fine, I misunderstood.

                            Edit: as for "just buy a pair of skis for 12m radius turns, yes, I've thought about that. Makes a lot of sense. I did it . But I've also skied short boards with 11m radius (the Dynastars and the Romp Rigor) and they ski like skiboards if you want them to (slide, slarve, light and short) but also can open-up nicely and carve clean wide turns (the 120s and the Raptors also do that). A long ski, even in short length like a 150-160cm is still a ski (heavier, bigger, more sluggish to react, needs planning your turns more).


                            Originally posted by Wookie View Post
                            For me I am really looking to take the best of the Spruce 120, Spliff, and Stickies and create a new generation long board skiboard. I still want the tight turning radius that characterizes skiboarding to me. If I wanted a 11 or 12 cm turning radius I would just buy a pair of skis. For me running down East Coast slopes at top speed making 3 or 4 long cruising turns is no fun (aka Skiing).

                            Having seen you and Macro skiboard down an East Coast slope, I thought you were going at speeds that even a 15-20m radius would put a smile on your face. For carving, a 6-7m radius works only at rather slow speeds, something like under 10-15mph. Faster than that and I don't think you will be doing small turns any more. I almost never skiboard that slowly, unless it is steep or deep. And if it is steep, I don't care about turn radius - I'm doing skidded turns anyway. If it is deep, again, I skid... For carving - yes it comes to personal preference how fast you go. Or do you carve at all? I think your style is more of a sliding than carving, in which case again the turn radius matters very little). Mine is carving unless I have to slarve or slide, so to me a too tight turn radius is really irritating for maybe 50% of my skiing (and doesn't really matter that much for the rest).

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              A Case for the 2018 RVL8 Chronic

                              When you have a one board quiver you may well have to accept less peak performance in certain conditions (sub par), but there is the trade off of simplicity and convenience. I have been the guy who swapped out his boards several times a day to suit the conditions; ice in the am, then a board for trees and bumps, then something to cruise the groomers and finally something for the pm slush. For me it creates a world of insecurity and doubt, constantly feeling that the board you have is not quite right. There is also a great satisfaction in adapting your skills and riding style to make a board work in all conditions. Most of all for me, it comes down to trying to eliminate choices and looking for the simple, minimalist way to ski. That's skiboards at their best. That doesn't mean you can't have an ice board or powder board for extreme conditions, but once you leave the parking lot, it's a pain to have to come back and swap out gear. Dance with who you brought.
                              Just these, nothing else !

                              Comment

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